Tuesday, September 16, 2008

Coordinator Of The Body of Elders

Christian Congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses
TO ALL BODIES OF ELDERS
Re: Coordinator of the body of elders
Dear Brothers:
Jehovah is the Supreme Overseer, and he has appointed Jesus Christ as head over the congregation. (Eph. 1:22; 1 Pet. 2:25) Congregation elders serve as shepherds, cooperating together with Jesus Christ and the faithful and discreet slave class for the advancement of Kingdom interests and for the good of the entire congregation.--Matt. 24:45; Eph. 4:15, 16.
One of the many positions of responsibility in the body of elders is that of presiding overseer. Effective January 1, 2009, the term "presiding overseer" will no longer be used, since that expression may convey the thought that one overseer holds more authority than the rest do. Scripturally, individual elders are to cooperate closely with the body of elders, with each member holding equal authority. Hence, no elder is above the others in the body, and none of them should try to dominate the others.--Matt. 23:10; od p. 37 par. 1.
In view of this, the designation "presiding overseer" is being changed to "coordinator of the body of elders." This term more correctly describes his role as one who helps the body of elders to work together harmoniously. He is not the coordinator of the congregation but rather the coordinator of the body of elders. In recognition of Christ's headship, he humbly works along with the other elders in caring for the flock of God.--Rom. 12:10; 1 Pet. 5:2,3.
We are confident that this adjustment will help all to more fully understand how the body of elders functions. Please accept a sincere expression of our appreciation for your tireless work in behalf of Kingdom interests.
Your brothers,
Christian Congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses
cc: Traveling overseers
PS to presiding overseer:
Please promptly arrange for this letter to be read to the body of elders. All the cited scriptures and the cited paragraph in the Organized book should be included in the reading. Thereafter, the secretary should place the letter in the congregaition's permanent file of policy letters. An announcement regarding this change will appear in Our Kingdom Ministry.

47 comments:

kimmy jo said...

Oh boy, maybe they figure this will create less conflict over who's the greatest.

Berean said...

Hmm... that reminds of something... something about lipstick and a pig... hmm...

Anonymous said...

District Assembly to District Convention. Colporter to Regular Pioneer. Vacation Pioneer to Auxiliary Pioneer. Back Call to Return Visit. Congregation Servant to Presiding Overseer to Coordinator of Elders. Pioneer requirements begin extremely high then plummet to the 50hrs which is about half previous. From Russel encouraging Christians to question and test their religion to the current Witness Inquisition at the sound of the slightest doubt.

The merry-go-round refuses to stop. Dizzying...

JoePublish said...

And who came up with the label "Presiding Overseer"? (The other elders? No. The flock? No. If it was such a bad label, why was it chosen to begin with???)

Here's the Dictionary's meaning to the word Preside: (1) be officially in charge - to be the chairperson or hold a similar position of authority (2) have control - to be the most powerful person or the one everyone else obeys.

Hmmm. Didn't the GB understand the meaning of this word??? Of course, they don't seem to understand the meaning of the expression "very soon" either.

Anonymous said...

I love it....you bloggers are in such spiritual darkness you can't see the forest for the trees.

It is obvious why these changes are being implimented, and in what order from the 70's when the elder arrangement was first introduced to now. A body of men, equally responsible for the flock, both local and in other Halls in close proximity. It has been a slow but well orchestrated adjustment to this arrangement. What a wise and Loving God Jehovah is!

Thank you Jehovah for such direction, I know it will serve your people well.

Anonymous said...

Secret Letters??????????

After the elders are informed, the information on the adjustment will be told to all of Jehovah's people in the Kingdom Ministry.

BIG SECRET........NOT!

BroInFlorida said...

The spirit of Anon's post is representative of the organization; whatever changes are made actually come from Jehovah Himself.

What?

And then when they make a reversal that resumes a position held decades before, that is progress, too? Is Jehovah really that deceitful to cause His people to pull a one-eighty only to pull another one-eighty right behind it?

I'm dizzy just responded to it.

"Merry-go-round" is a good way to describe the dizzying lunacy that is WT doctrine.

Anonymous said...

"well orchestrated adjustment"

Dude, please volunteer for 2 weeks at Bethel. This will SO get you past the notion that anything is "well orchestrated". You'll soon discover, as I did, that the Stupid Police studied most aspects of Bethel life and implemented their rules. It's a marvel to behold.

The voluntary donation literature arrangement was implemented the month after Jimmy Swaggart lost his tax case in court. Was this Jehovah's well orchestrated timetable?

Occam's Razor, baby. Occam's Razor.

JoePublish said...

(Said with much sarcasm) I can't wait for Jehovah to relate the next understanding of the "generation".

And, that's the problem with this religion. Good people altered their lives according to CORE teachings that changed. (The END keeps getting pushed out further while all the time the GB insists it is VERY NEAR.)

Unfortunately no current undertanding is immune to the changes from the GB (who are just men).

You know a religion is in trouble when their "CORE teachings" change, and then change again!

tohsibor said...

I would love to see how this proves it is God's arrangement or his hand in the matter. The organization behind Jehovah's Witnesses including their beliefs and teachings appear similar to other religious organizations/sects started around the same time:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christadelphians#Organization

What makes Jehovah's Witnesses the "one true religion"?
http://www.4jehovah.org/wdgr_s01q06.php

Anonymous said...

I read somewhere that cults place a huge value on changing common words and descriptions. This allows each cult member to instantly recognize a non-member or an imposter.

If you show up at a Kingdom Hell and ask, "Who is the Presiding Overseer, here?", everyone will immediately know you're not a 'True Christian' keeping up the with the Celestial Chariot, speaking the 'Pure Language'.

So, the word/terminology changes are a cult survival mechanism.

Anonymous said...

I can't talk--got to call my sister right a way. Being "in the know" is so important in her congregation they'll be tripping over each other's feet to be first to spread the word.

(And I'll ROTF laughing knowing it came from an YIKES! site that's not "official". Ooops, that makes it "apostate", doesn't it?

J said...

Anonymous States:
"I read somewhere that cults place a huge value on changing common words and descriptions. This allows each cult member to instantly recognize a non-member or an imposter."

I remember as a child we actually were taught that this would help us survive Armageddon and identify government agents who snuck into the hall.

The thing is that all these things seem so ‘Deep’ when you are a JW. Once you’re out as Anon says “Occam's Razor, baby. Occam's Razor.” You can predict the next several moves that ‘Jehovah’ makes. ‘He’ a.k.a old yes men in Brooklyn, just take the next step in cult survival 101.

What amazes me is the JWs that say ‘oh we follow the Bible’. But if you ask them if the Watchtower had new light on blood, beards and rock n’ roll would they change their view? ‘oh yes’. This shows they follow men not God.

(I am expecting massive cult responses on this post so don’t expect me to respond. Which brings me to my next post about the mathematical solution to the Trump Card)

Anonymous said...

Trump Card = Faithful & Discreet Slave (as Watchtower sees fit to define the term)

Nothing can penetrate that pillar of circular reasoning.

"We have the truth. The slave told us so. I know I'm right because the slave said so. Only the slave is right. They said so. Everyone else is wrong, because the slave said so. The slave is occasionally wrong, but they are still the only ones that are right. They told me so. The slave is the slave. Don't disrespect the slave. The slave told me I shouldn't disrespec them. Did I mention the slave. Anything critical of the slave is wrong, by default...says the slave."

Anonymous said...

I do not believe that there is a single thing that happens with Jehovah's Witnesses that you bloggers couldn't find something NEGATIVE to spit out.

If the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society did any or all you suggest it would not be enough for you twits whining here on this blog sponcered by a JW traitor.

J said...

The mathematical solution to the Trump Card
If X < TP then TP ≠ TP

Correct my symbols if they are off. But what I am trying to say is this.

If all doctrine is less than the Trump Card, then the Trump Card is really not equal to the Trump Card at all.

Or in other terms: JWs win all discussions of doctrine by default as a result of the fact they are guided by the Faithful Slave which is guided by God. This means that all other religions are false. Only JW’s teach the truth.

So JW’s don’t say ‘oh we are just another religion.’ ‘we have some right and some wrong’. If they said that, they would not be professing a trump card. However if they do profess the ‘we are always right’ trump card then the following holds true.

If one can prove they are not always right, and that they are not ‘more right’ than ‘every other religion’. One has dispelled the trump card. Which by default makes the inverse true, namely they are wrong.

So take any matter discussed on this board. Most matters of doctrine are not black and white. Almost every topic discussed on this board falls into this category. But since JW’s have the trump card they insist oh yes, we are right. It is black and white. After some friendly banter the JW admits that one could take it either way. Cross, Trinity, etc.

So the JW says see we are not wrong. We just can’t prove were right. They may suggest it’s just one point that doesn’t matter. But in the end when you add all the points (X) up if each cannot be firmly supported then you have no trump card. The trump card can only work for a church if all their beliefs or the majority is correct.

If they are right and wrong on points, fine no big deal. But they can’t claim to be God’s sole channel. They can’t shun members who don’t tow the line on every single point.

tohsibor said...

Anonymous said...
"I do not believe that there is a single thing that happens with Jehovah's Witnesses that you bloggers couldn't find something NEGATIVE to spit out.
If the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society did any or all you suggest it would not be enough for you twits whining here on this blog sponcered by a JW traitor."

Funny, because I do not believe that there is a single thing that happens with Jehovah’s Witnesses that the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses couldn’t find something POSITIVE to spit out.

Because they are always right. When they’re wrong they’re right. They are right to be wrong. At least all the aforementioned are true in the eyes of the faithful and discrete slave of Jehovah’s Witnesses and all those who buy into their teaching and beliefs.

What may be enough for “twits” is if the Governing Body would come clean respecting their past and present:

-If they would state they are just “trying” to do the right thing and have screwed up with their own interpretation of the scriptures known as “The New World Translation”. Admit to not being a “one” true organization or “one” truth period. Rather, have Jesus as the focal and stop their claims of exclusiveness in communicating with God.

-If they admitted to calling and knowing that Jesus (The Word) was God and not a god. They did so once, find the 1969 Edition of the Kingdom interlinear Translation published by the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society and lookup John 1:1. It’s been out of print for many years and not available on any of the CD-ROM Watchtower library discs.

-Stop celebrating anniversaries and weddings, stop recognizing days of the week and months of the year. Stop wearing wedding rings or anything else associated with wedding ceremonies; because all of those things have Pagan origins. Either that, or stop the ridiculous ban on all holiday and birthday celebrations because you’re hypocritical if you follow some things with Pagan Origins and not all things. The fact is just about everything can be tied to Pagan origins. So, should not “true” Christians follow the Bible’s clear directions as stated in Romans 14:5, instead of an organization?

-Stop the ridiculous blood transfusion ban. There is no scriptural backing for it. No matter how you want to twist or interpret the scriptures – it does not make it the right choice or decision that must be followed. Or at the very least, again stop the hypocrisy and stop eating red meat. Because all red meat contains some whole blood which when eating you are consuming and digesting.

If they made just those above changes, maybe some of the “twits” would stop. We can wait to see what happens, but I wouldn’t hold my breath on it.

Voice of Reason said...

Who cares about that.

This is the true religion.

This shows that we seek truth and change to make us better.

Those who complain, wish to stay behind.

Anonymous said...

The morning after your failed prophecies, of course you CHANGE. This doesn't prove anything, except that Watchtower can't say "Armageddon happened in 1975", if it manifestly did not.

Only the worst of false prophets would say their failed prophecies came true. Watchtower is right up with the very best false prophets. Of course they CHANGE. It's about survival and mind control. They couldn't very well come out and admit they are, in fact, NOT God's sole channel on earth, could they?

Watchtower & Obama: All about the CHANGE!

Nobama 2008
"Keep the Change"

tohsibor said...

Voice of Reason said...
"This is the true religion."

Prove it. What makes it the true religion? And please define "true religion".

Anonymous said...

Who sets the criteria for the True Religion? The slave.

Who is the Slave? The people that run the True Religion

Round and round and round and round.

Or, we can just go by what Jesus said. He didn't need a Watchtower article to explain it. (I forgot, you don't believe in the Watchtower. Excuse me.) He didn't need 192-page book written by the Christian Congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses to explain it.

He said there would be love among his disciples. He said that wherever two or more of them are gathered together, he would be there.

We can either follow the circular logic of The Slave/Trump Card, or just listen to Jesus' words.

When a person tells us they believe in Jesus and they pray and they have the Holy Spirit, we can accept their word, or them call them a liar, and as our excuse, we can say: "The slave says your a false Christian. The slave says you're a part of the Harlot. The slave says you're a spiritual fornicating pagan piece of bird food about to die. Your prayers are not heard. You talk to yourself. Your preacher is a crook. The slave said so. The slave is never wrong, except when they are wrong, and then they admit it. But, anyway, the slave. The slave. The slave, people. The slave."

I think we all know who the 'slaves' really are.

In all seriousness, I have much sympathy for those enslaved to a human organization, all the while believing they are serving the One True God of the Bible, without Jesus being their Mediator.

Please open your mind, pray for wisdom and put your beliefs to the test.

J said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
J said...

Anon States:
"I do not believe that there is a single thing that happens with Jehovah's Witnesses that you bloggers couldn't find something NEGATIVE to spit out."

Anon. You are right. Many so called 'apostates' need to move on. But the point is that the JW leadership claims to the sole channel to God and trashes all other Christian Religions.

When you bash other churches a little bashing sometimes comes back your way.

And it is a little hard to just move on for many who have family still stuck in the cult. Family who refuses to speak to us based on rules made by man.

In the majority of cases 'apostates' did nothing to deserve such terrible treatment by their friends in the org. Simple honesty to a couple of Elders will get you thrown out any day of the week. I know I was there.

But you are correct in saying that people get a little carried with uncalled for bashing. It's wrong, no doubt about it. Sort of like calling Christians part of a harlot, or telling people they will not be saved if they use a cross, or claiming the God many Christians worship is a pagan triune God.

Yeah. I did it. Many JWs do it. I do regret doing it though.

Voice of Reason said...

The Watchtower did not say that armagaeddon would definitely happen in 1975.

And change is a good thing.

Voice of Reason said...

"What makes it the true religion? And please define "true religion". "

mw defines it as " the service and worship of God"

We have the true religion because we worship Jehovah God through Jesus.

Your complaints about the Watchtower does not change that because you can't touch Jesus.

Anonymous said...

'Who cares about that.

This is the true religion.'

This was said by 'The voice of reason.' I have never seen such incisive, astute reasoning in all my life.

I AM READY TO BELIEVE!

Anonymous said...

It is the same sort of circular reasoning used by all Christians.

'The Bible is Gods word.'

How do you know?

'Because the Bible says it is.'

Ahh. Right.

Voice of Reason said...

"But the point is that the JW leadership claims to the sole channel to God and trashes all other Christian Religions."

No, the JW leadership does not claim that. It is more than the governing body. It is the entire teaching program we have that Jehovah communicates with us.

And we do not trash all other Christian religions as there are no other Christian religions.

Anonymous said...

Voice of Reason wrote:

"There are no other Christian religons."

Because the slave says so! The slave, people, the slave! The slave said it, so it's true. It doesn't matter what Jesus said. It's all about the slave!

Mormons say the same thing. The Worldwide Church of God says the same thing. Do we take their word for it? Of course not. We examine the evidence.

"That which can be asserted without evidence, can be DISMISSED without evidence."

Try again, Voice of Unreason.

Epic Failure!

JoePublish said...

I do believe that Ronde has morphed into other pseudo names on this web-blog. If I hear any references to quotes from his favorite movie (Rocky), then I’ll know for sure. LOL

btw: It is interesting how the WTS can put negative articles about other religions in their own publications, but when the table gets turned (via the Internet), all of a sudden everyone is a JW basher. Look, the majority of comments come from people who have been there and they have personally witnessed things (like the mishandling of pedophile members) that they feel necessary to express opinions about - what's so wrong with that?

J said...

I state:
“JW leadership claims to the sole channel to God”

Voice of reason states:
“No, the JW leadership does not claim that.”

I hate to get all WTLIB on you but here it is.

*** w60 7/15 p. 439 par. 2 Staying Awake with the “Faithful and Discreet Slave” ***
The facts show that during this time and up to the present hour the “slave” class has served as God’s sole collective channel for the flow of Biblical truth to men on earth.


*** w67 10/1 p. 590 par. 19 Finding Freedom with Jehovah’s Visible Organization ***
Jehovah poured out his spirit upon them and assigned them the responsibility of serving as his sole visible channel,


Voice of reason states:
”And we do not trash all other Christian religions as there are no other Christian religions.”

That would be like me saying. I don’t trash decent or smart people. I only trash the JW defenders on this blog. Come on.

Voice of Reason said...

"'There are no other Christian religons.'"
"Because the slave says so! The slave, people, the slave! The slave said it, so it's true. It doesn't matter what Jesus said. It's all about the slave!"

No, not because any slave says so. Because it is not reasonable for there to be many Christian religions. There is only one Christ so there is only one group following him.

Voice of Reason said...

Joe said:
"It is interesting how the WTS can put negative articles about other religions in their own publications, but when the table gets turned (via the Internet), all of a sudden everyone is a JW basher."

There is a difference that ignorant antijw minds won't see. When JWs bash other religions all other religions, we give them a positive alternative. And when people become JWs they do not bash their former religion, they give hope to all.

When antiJWs bash us, they do not have any positive alternatives. Some will make the ignorant statement of 'come to christ'. Ah, but we have come to Christ.

Voice of Reason said...

J said and quoted the Watchtowers:

"The facts show that during this time and up to the present hour the “slave” class has served as God’s sole collective channel for the flow of Biblical truth to men on earth."

That is true, but the slaveclass is not just the JW leadership.

The other quote refers to the visible organization.

Note that Jehovah communicates with us through his written word.
He also communicates to us through his organization; through
publications, programs like the circuit overseer's visit and through representatives, at
meetings, assemblies, conventions.

The Pastor said...

Voice of Reason:

Please define the "slave class". If you believe it's the anointed remnant, then we need evidence that the anointed remnant provide spiritual food to the organization. I have evidence to the contrary. I have known several anointed ones. My brother-in-law is of the anointed. He doesn't provide anyone with spiritual food. He receives his food through the channels you've described.

You may also recall that Russell and Rutherford provided ALL spiritual food when they were in office. There was no class. (You can confirm this in the Proclaimers book.)

So, I'm presenting evidence that the anointed remnant, as a class, have never dispensed spiritual food. It has been, at most, a select few persons who do this.

The idea that the anointed remanant are a slave class, providing food, is a persistant myth.

Voice of Reason said...

Pastor asked:

"Voice of Reason:
Please define the "slave class". "

Do you want the textbook definition or the real one?

"If you believe it's the anointed remnant, then we need evidence that the anointed remnant provide spiritual food to the organization."

That is the textbook definition.

The real definition is the entire spiritual feeding program to the congregations.


" I have evidence to the contrary. "

Yada, yada, yada.

"I have known several anointed ones. My brother-in-law is of the anointed. He doesn't provide anyone with spiritual food. He receives his food through the channels you've described."

Well, as I said, that is the difference between the textbook and the real definition. The anointed started the spiritual feeding program, but in the past 20-30 years it continues without them.


"You may also recall that Russell and Rutherford provided ALL spiritual food when they were in office. There was no class."

That is the textbook definition as the anointed back then did everything. They did the writing, directing, printing, preaching. But today they don't. They started the process.

"So, I'm presenting evidence that the anointed remnant, as a class, have never dispensed spiritual food. It has been, at most, a select few persons who do this."

It is not that all the anointed did it.

"The idea that the anointed remanant are a slave class, providing food, is a persistant myth."


No, you just don't understand what it means and how it works. You look to the Watchtower definition too much.

The Pastor said...

Voice of Reason wrote: "The anointed started the spiritual feeding program, but in the past 20-30 years it continues without them."

I would like to kindly let you know that if this is your opinion, and you go to your elders with this, and maintain this opinion, they have a legitimate basis for disfellowshipping you.

As funny as it seems, that is exactly what you are a part of. You are not allowed to have your own ideas about how God's organization works.

The current teaching is that the anointed remanant provide the spiritual food. If you don't agree with this, you're an apostate (gasp) or a JW impersonator.

Voice of Reason said...

Pastor said:
"Voice of Reason wrote: 'The anointed started the spiritual feeding program, but in the past 20-30 years it continues without them.'

"I would like to kindly let you know that if this is your opinion, and you go to your elders with this, and maintain this opinion, they have a legitimate basis for disfellowshipping you."

I did not mean that there are no anointed, but the 9 on the governing body are not enough to make a separation between the anointed and those not. And this is not my opinion, this is fact.

And why should I take this to my congregation's overseers? How is it their business? And they are not interested in disfellowshipping anyone.

"As funny as it seems, that is exactly what you are a part of. You are not allowed to have your own ideas about how God's organization works."

Where do you get this idea? Not in reality?

"The current teaching is that the anointed remanant provide the spiritual food. If you don't agree with this, you're an apostate (gasp) or a JW impersonator."

Since there are only 9 members of the anointed remnant ( I don't go by the number of partakers) for all intents and purposes, there is no more remnant as far as the spiritual feeding goes. They are there in name only. But it does not matter anymore. The truth is the truth regardless.

J said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
J said...

VoR States:

"Because it is not reasonable for there to be many Christian religions. There is only one Christ so there is only one group following him."

Yes, it is called Christianity


"When JWs bash other religions all other religions, we give them a positive alternative. And when people become JWs they do not bash their former religion, they give hope to all."

Yes we do, again it's called Christianity. No alternative is stating ‘we are God’s sole channel’. If that’s the case, what about 1860, who was the ‘group’ then? Wasn’t it people following the Bible and God’s spirit? How is it that those scriptural definitions are now not valid today? They were good for the first several hundred years.

“Note that Jehovah communicates with us through his written word.”
I think we can all agree on that. So what happens when his word is in conflict with the ones you describe as “no more remnant as far as the spiritual feeding goes. They are there in name only.”?

Again as ‘the pastor’ says you realize that’s not what JW’s teach at all. They very much teach that the anointed are leading the group known as Jehovah’s Witnesses. So do you agree with WTLIB or not? I can quote all day long from it and show that your views are not in harmony with that of Jehovah’s Witnesses. If you don’t accept the view presented in the Watchtower then you are deceiving yourself if you think you are one of them.
_________________________________
Ok so here is a question for you VoR:

“They are there in name only. But it does not matter anymore. The truth is the truth regardless.”

Can you support this teaching that the 'other sheep' are leading the org in scripture?

Anonymous said...

If they admitted to calling and knowing that Jesus (The Word) was God and not a god. They did so once, find the 1969 Edition of the Kingdom interlinear Translation published by the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society and lookup John 1:1. It’s been out of print for many years and not available on any of the CD-ROM Watchtower library discs.

I looked up the 1969 Kingdom Interlinear and it said nothing of the kind. Where do you get your information from?

Anonymous said...

There is no definite article in the Greek before the second occurrence of God, so the WT translated the word “a god”. So far, they are consistent with their supposed rule that if a noun has no definite article it is indefinite. However, just five verses later, in the New World Translation, we have this:

John 1:6 “There arose a man that was sent forth as a representative of God: his name was John.” There is no definite article in the Greek before the word “God” in John 1:6, yet the WT translates it “God”, with a capital “G”!

This translation is absolutely correct, but it demolishes the WT’s “rule” that when there is no definite article present the noun must, of necessity, be translated as an indefinite [“a God”, hence a “god”]. The following occurrences of the word “God”, in the WT’s own New World Translation, are translated with a capital “G” even though there is no definite article, no “the”, present: John 3:2; John 13:3; 1 Thess. 2:5, 1 Pet. 4:10,11 (four occurrences of the word “God”, two with the article, two without, yet all four are translated by the WT as “God”, capital “G”!

And to show how flexible the WT is in observing its own “rule” when it doesn’t serve the WT’s purpose, we quote Heb. 9:14 in the NWT: “How much more will the blood of the Christ, who through an everlasting spirit offered himself without blemish to God, cleanse our consciences from dead works that we may render sacred service to [the] living God?” There is no definite article before the word “God” in the Greek, yet the WT not only translates it “God” with a capital “G”, but supplies the definite article that is not present in the Greek! The WT translates it correctly here, but it broke its own “rule” to do that! So the “rule” is not absolute, just convenient in places like in John 1:1 where the Word, Jesus, is called God!

Voice of Reason said...

"There is no definite article in the Greek before the second occurrence of God, so the WT translated the word “a god”. So far, they are consistent with their supposed rule that if a noun has no definite article it is indefinite. However, just five verses later, in the New World Translation, we have this:"

Well, since Jesus is the son of God he is not God. So he has to have been "a god" or divine.

Anonymous said...

Voice of Reason wrote: "Well, since Jesus is the son of God he is not God. So he has to have been "a god" or divine."

You're starting to find the truth, and you don't even know it.

Jews and Christians are MONOTHEISTIC. If Christ is Divine, or A GOD, and not the same God as the Father, you are promoting POLYTHEISM.

The burden is therefore on you to find a single Scripture that supports POLYTHEISM.

Before you get started, I can quote many Scriptures that support the view of MONOTHESIM, meaning there is only ONE true God.

Voice of Reason said...

"Jews and Christians are MONOTHEISTIC. If Christ is Divine, or A GOD, and not the same God as the Father, you are promoting POLYTHEISM."

No, that is not. Theism means that one is worshipped as the almighty God. We do not view him as that. Jesus was a spirit being, came to earth, died and then was resurrected a spirit being as the son of Jehovah God.

No polytheism there. That is monotheism.

"The burden is therefore on you to find a single Scripture that supports POLYTHEISM."

Why? We do not support it.

"Before you get started, I can quote many Scriptures that support the view of MONOTHESIM, meaning there is only ONE true God."

I agree. JWs believe in monotheism.

Anonymous said...

As long as you believe Christ is a God or divine, that is, by definition, polythesim.

You've been playing word games, non-stop on here. You may continue to do so.

This will not confuse honest-hearted people.

There is one God. JWs don't know him.

JoePublish said...

Okay, so they are changing the name of the "Presiding Overseer" and the reasons where given, even though the F&DS came up with the name to begin with.

Well, shouldn't the same logic and reasoning apply to "Special Pioneers", listed in the KM? (What's so SPECIAL about them? Why aren't they changing their name?)