Friday, March 13, 2009

Former teacher jailed for trying to abduct girl in Holywell
Mar 12 2009 by Our Correspondent, Western Mail
A FORMER teacher, businessman and senior Jehovah’s Witness who tried to abduct a five-year-old was yesterday jailed for six years.
Robert Edward Bill, 54, was told by a judge that he was still in denial about his predatory interest in young children despite a series of convictions.
He has been found guilty at separate trials of the attempted abduction of the girl in Holywell two years ago, of indecently assaulting a seven-year-old 10 years ago, and of possessing 730 pornographic images of children.
Prosecuting at Caernarfon Crown Court, Simon Medland described how the girl had been returning home from a playground when Bill, “for malign purposes”, drew up in his car and asked: “Have you seen a cat?”
By chance the girl’s uncle arrived at the scene at that moment and her mother, who had been watching from a window, ran to her.
Mr Medland said Bill of The Roe, St Asaph, Denbighshire, had been driving slowly around areas where he was likely to come into contact with children that same day. He’d claimed that he was trying to fix a mechanical problem with his car.
A police inquiry had revealed the car had also been driven in an “odd manner” at Flint that day, stopping when children came into view.
Mr Medland said that when Bill had a playground equipment company he had been warned off a Towyn holiday park by police after officials there became concerned about his conduct with children.
The barrister said the indecent assault had occurred at St Asaph. Although the girl had recalled seeing a camera there was no evidence it had been used.
David Potter, defending, pointed out the offences did not involve touching, grabbing or coercion.
He said Bill had hoped to return to teaching, but this would now be impossible.
Bill had also run two successful businesses in the past, but his last one had now been effectively wound up. He was a family man, a grandfather described as being devoted to his wife of 30 years.
Since his arrest in June 2007, Mr Potter said Bill had had a torrid time. He accepted the need for his behaviour to be monitored in future and that his actions had brought fear and suspicion for his family and church, while the nightmare of his arrest would be a constant reminder that his life would never be the same.
Judge Philip Hughes imposed a four-year sentence for attempted abduction, one-and-a-half years for indecent assault and six months for possessing the pornographic images most of which, he said, were of the lowest category.
He said: “The nature of your offending demonstrates you have an unhealthy sexual and predatory interest in young children which, despite your convictions, you continue to deny.”
Bill, who has been in custody for nearly 18 months, will have to register as a sex offender for 10 years and a Sexual Offences Prevention Order was made which limits any contact with children.
Bill, in a neat grey suit and tie, had wept during part of the evidence. As he left the dock to begin his sentence, he embraced his son and kissed his wife as he passed behind where they sat awaiting their sentences.
Jacqueline Bill, his 51-year-old wife, received a suspended six-month jail sentence after pleading guilty to trying to pervert the course of justice by destroying a laptop hard drive, and must do 250 hours unpaid work.
Bill’s son David, 24, of Mount Road, St Asaph, must do 150 hours unpaid work after also admitting that he tried to pervert the course of justice.
Judge Hughes told them: “I recognise that you were both in a misguided way trying to protect a husband and father.”

18 comments:

jwcpp said...

Although I'm not against honest reporting of news, I find the way this article is featured unacceptable and irresponsible. We know that Witnesses sometimes do wrong; we never asserted otherwise.

There are nearly 130,000 Jehovah's Witnesses in Great Britain. In any city of 130,000 people you are going to have some crime. That doesn't make all the city's residents guilty. Even if we were able to reduce the incidence to one hundredth of that found in society in general, there would still be some cases.

If we were to highlight crimes committed by black people only, that would be racist. If we did it with Jews, it would be antisemitic. Why should it be any different when it is Jehovah's Witnesses?

It's not the reporting as such that is wrong; it's the implication that this is somehow the norm rather than a deviation from it, the implicit declaration of all Jehovah's Witnesses "guilty by association". It's the anti-Witness agenda exposed on this site that is so objectionable.

trebor said...

jwcpp said...
"It's not the reporting as such that is wrong; it's the implication that this is somehow the norm rather than a deviation from it, the implicit declaration of all Jehovah's Witnesses "guilty by association". It's the anti-Witness agenda exposed on this site that is so objectionable."


Then you would agree when Jehovah's Witnesses distribute publications including Watchtower magazines and tracts from the Watch Tower Society using such a broad paint brush on apostates or other religious faiths, it is also so objectionable.

It would also be so objectionable to tell Jehovah's Witnesses not to listen to so-called apostates because they are all evil and individuals just filled with hate.

Furthermore, it is very objectionable for Jehovah's Witnesses to be grouped as being the only ones who have a so-called "truth" without listening to both sides of the argument; including doing research and investigation outside of the publications and meetings of the organization.

The Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses has approved and published through the printing company of the Watch Tower Bible Tract Society numerous "guilt by association" articles. This is "unacceptable", "irresponsible" and "objectionable".

MTI said...

What an organization of "clean people"...

W. Lockhart said...

jwcpp, you go to great lengths to establish that the JWs are bound to experience some serious crime, by making a comparison with any city of 130,00 people, but remember, this is allegedly an organisation with holy spirit, the most upstanding people available. Your argument is basically so bent on claiming they're just like everyone else that you've forgotten that.

What you've done is an exercise in apologetics. You have a pre-conceived idea (the JW belief system is right) and you seek to apologise for it. It's similar to people who apologise for the absurdity or violence in the bible. Their premise is that it is definitely inspired of god, so they assume their must be a good explanation for slicing babies to death in their mother's arms, even thought their is none. Apologetics.

Another example is the ignorance of the biblical times. People back then did not realise the importance of the human brain. They thought the heart, kidneys and bowels were the seats of emotion. The brain barely gets a mention in the scriptures, but this doesn't surprise a thinking person because the book was written in a barbaric and ignorant age, by men, and not with the inspiration of any god or creator.

Of course, a JW will not accept this, and will engage in rationalization. They will seek some explanation for the absurdity, since they have already established their premise that the bible is inspired. It is an exercise in apologetics, and it is irrational.

Irrational: The bible is inspired. Therefore let's seek the explanations which no doubt exist for the absurdities (wrong way around).

Rational: Let's read the passages in the bible first, with due open-mindedness and skepticism. Then we'll see whether or not it's inspired by anything important (right way around).

So my advice is to not engage in apology making for an organisation which is no more deserving of it than any other. The author here is focussing on the witnesses to expose their hypocrisy for claiming to be a refuge from the world's troubles.

jwcpp said...

This is allegedly an organisation with holy spirit, the most upstanding people available. Your argument is basically so bent on claiming they're just like everyone else that you've forgotten that.

I claimed nothing of the sort. I simply pointed out that in a large organization, sometimes people will do things they shouldn't. It's the individuals concerned who don't have holy spirit, not the organization itself. I do very strongly object to isolated cases like these being used to try and discredit an entire religion, when the persons involved know very well that what the individual did goes against everything that the religion stands for.


What you've done is an exercise in apologetics. You have a pre-conceived idea (the JW belief system is right) and you seek to apologise for it.

I dispute that. If I saw an article that was exactly the same, only it said "Jew" or "Black" instead of "Jehovah's Witness" and it was hosted on the blog of an individual hostile to Jews or Blacks, I would draw exactly the same conclusions as I have here.

I also happen to think that objective observers would agree with me.

I'm not going to answer the other comment in detail. There's nothing apostates would like more than free access to our congregations to try to propagate their ideas. I'm not giving them one ounce of support.

W. Lockhart said...

"There's nothing apostates would like more than free access to our congregations to try to propagate their ideas."

Of course, since apostates spend their entire day thinking evil thoughts and planning evil schemes in their relentless campaign to derail the JW oligarchy. Sigh.

By accepting the view of the society that apostates have horns on their head, you may derive some satisfaction (by enabling you to change the subject and not properly tackle their claims), but it won't help anyone.

Amazingly, you are engagin in apostate behavior yourself. As I have said to others, by even reading this site you are commiting a grave sin. What would your elders think? This is the definition of hypocrisy.

As for your so-called reponse to my comments, no, these reports are not isolated incidents, and I see you didn't even respond to my accusation of apologetics. I suspect you don't even know what I mean by that. You fall squarely into my irrational box which I discussed, without even realising it. It is precisely this which "objective observers", as you put it, will see.

Reader2008 said...

OK, Lockhart, I am completely disappointed in you. I just might report you directly to Ray Franz if you don't change your ways.

I know that every waking minute of every day I do everything that I can to destroy the empire that the JWs have built. If you are not doing the same, then you are letting us all down.

Do you not remember the classes that we all took of perpetuating evil? Do you not understand our responsibility toward evil?

You disgust me with your weakness.

For god's sake...er...I mean...for Christ's sake.....uh...OK....just be more evil.

Have to go....brain is weakening....can't stand the pressures of atheism.....I am so without hope....and lonely.....please help.

W. Lockhart said...

You're right Reader, I'm going to turn over a new leaf. From now on I will focus on assaulting the JW society directly. I must have mistakenly thought my own life was far more important!

Taking 20 seconds to post on a forum is not sufficient evil methinks. It's time to stand outside a kingdom hall handing out leaflets and shouting insults. How else are we to achieve our nefarious aims?

Ringwielder said...

'I'm not giving them one ounce of support.'

Yes you are. By posting on this blog. Anyone reading this can see for themselves how weak your argument is and that you are a hypocrite for even being here.

Have a nice day.

Voice of Reason said...

So this is a letter from the Governing body?

What is a "senior Jehovah's Witness"

If he is 54, how can he be a "senior Jehovah's Witness"?

What does that have to do with the religion, because a person is alleged to have done that?

Yeah I said it said...

thank you, content! :)

re: the blanket statement that jws will have some crimes...the problem has nothing to do with this, the problem is the arrogance from the top of the watchtower society.

they never take responsibility for their previous failings, only propose that new light has come along, and people die listening to their blanket statements.

the watchtower is the worst when it comes to ethics, and one of those editors should take a journalism class....they quote out of context all the time and then pull "scientific studies" out of their hats w/o giving the reason for the study, who funded it, etc.

remember, in before the YPA book, masturbation lead to homosexuality and homosexuality means death...now their stand is homosexuals are okay, just don't practice it....essentially just a little less stupid than in the 1980's w/o ever mentioning previous writings...but they'll whack the catholic church up and down for every little infraction.

i know, the catholic church isn't the golden boy, but the one thing that runs the jws is arrogance...from watchtower society to districts to circuits to the elders, the trickle down effect is in full force.

btw, love this blog..what's the status? will it be as infrequent or did something go down?

thedude said...

"they never take responsibility for their previous failings, "

Who cares about "they".

Just mind your own business and don't worry about any "they".

"remember, in before the YPA book, masturbation lead to homosexuality and homosexuality means death...now their stand is homosexuals are okay, just don't practice it."


This shows that you don't know what you are talking about as homosexuals are not okay. Homos are wrong.

Pamela said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
W. Lockhart said...

@ The dude

Your enormous hypocrisy makes me gag. You tell others to mind their own business, yet you poke your nose into others' sexual business, just like the WT society you (poorly) defend.

Homosexuality arises naturally in any population sample, and it even occurs in the animal kingdom. Even the old WT GB, slow as ever to keep up with changing times, now acknowledges this fact. Still, their new attitude of let's help you with your "problem" is repulsive.

I'm straight as an arrow, so don't create any straw men by the way. My strong defense is borne of clear thinking, a rare condition which you, like most, lack in its entirety. Your repulsive view is all the more vividly illustrated by your use of the abbreviation "homo" to demonstrate your prejudice and bigotry.

Of course, none of this suprises me, since your record of dialogue on this forum is disastrously poor. This is understandable, since only two types of JW would ever be drawn so powerfully to an apostate website.

1) An apostate in the making
2) An intellectually challenged dullard.

Yeah I said it said...

"they" are the governing body and writing committee.

thedude said...

""they" are the governing body and writing committee."

But my question was:

Who cares about the 'they'?

W. Lockhart said...

When people ruin the lives of others, you can be sure that lots and lots of people will "care" about it.

By the way "thedude", it's good to see you ignoring every single point in my post as usual. Appropriate, somehow, considering your complete inability to refute the points made.

Here's what I think: I think you used the response by another person as an excuse to "hop" over my own response. Why don't you go back and carefully read what I wrote, and then think about how much you're wasting your entire life - because that's what it comes down to in the end.

Yeah I said it said...

i liked thedude better when he was bowling and drinking white russians...not as a troll.